Brody's Scribbles... The Bible Is Very Clear About Homosexuality

Editor's Note To Readers: The following dialog occurred between two individuals discussing differing viewpoints and perspectives regarding the Gay Equality Rights movement as it pertains to Christianity.  They have requested to remain anonymous.

Photos Courtesy of the American Family Association of Michigan and Joe Mirabella from The Bilerico Project.

Point: I am stunned by those in the homosexual lobby who say it is "intolerant" to even disagree with them. Why isn't it "intolerant" for them to disagree with me?

If the homosexuals were REALLY tolerant, they would be very willing to let others express their opinions, even though they disagree. Let the issues be discussed in a peaceful and tolerant way. That is what the Manhattan Declaration does (if anyone has actually read it).

How many Christians are saying that homosexuals should be banned from expressing their opinions? Not many. How many homosexuals are saying that Christians should be banned from expressing their opinions? A very large number. So which group is really intolerant?

The homosexual lobby has been very shrewd and politically savvy in the debate, following the plan laid out many years ago by the Marxists: plead for tolerance and work at re-educating the youth and swaying opinion-makers; and then when you gain enough power, clamp down and impose your own intolerance on your opponents. It's been done many times before, and the homosexual lobby has done it well. The only problem is that homosexuality remains a very unhealthy lifestyle, plagued by disease and despair.

A free society cannot long continue after it loses its moral bearings. Unfortunately, that is happening in America today, and as it does, our liberties become more and more imperiled. Without a moral code and strength of character to govern ones own actions, the State must grow more and more powerful to impose order. So now the increasingly powerful State is imposing the will of the homosexual lobby on the rest of society. Is that freedom? Is that tolerance?

One of the most oppressive patterns of public discourse now emmanates from the homosexuals. There are very few segments of society that are more vicious, intolerant, bigoted and angry than the homosexual lobby. It's sad, but by all evidence it comes with the lifestyle. May God have mercy on them. From the Bible! This is just one such passage: 1 Timothy 1:8-11.

COUNTERPOINT: It really ticks me off when your type quotes the bible yet you know nothing about it. Yes, the "new" version you quote says "homosexuals" but that's an interpretation. Older translations used the word Sodomites. For your information, Sodomites were a particular group of pedophiles. Ancient Greeks who kept young male sexual slaves. In fact this was all about Greeks and the ancient Greek city of Ephesus. He also gets down on Greek mythology and the legendary Greek Gods and history accepted by many in that city. The Greeks had no problem with this and in fact it was part of their practice to introduce boys into the military. The Greeks had a very strong military that was feared by most others at the time. You can interpret this to mean homosexuality, but that's only true in the description of the acts. Timothy was referring to that very specific group. The Greeks didn't see this as homosexuality at all and it wasn't about adult males together, but adult males who kept, mentored and had sex with their young males they took in. This relationship had little bearing on their heterosexual lives and was considered completely separate. Today we would probably call them pedophiles who targeted only males. In Timothy's time pedophiles who's victims were female was considered to be quite acceptable as women were possessions anyway. In fact Timothy says "I do not permit a woman to teach or to have authority over a man; she must be silent." (1:2:12) Males on the other hand had rights.

The point is, in this case as in many others, biblical quotes are taken entirely out of context and re-interpreted to fit some desired implications. Your type does this all the time on a variety of topics. The fact is in this case, Timothy was not addressing homosexuality. He was addressing the beliefs and practices of a very specific Greek city, a lot of which didn't fit well with Christianity at the time. Timothy himself was Greek with a Greek father and Jewish mother. The apostle Paul mentored Timothy and put him in charge of the growing Christian church in the Greek city of Ephesus. Paul is said to have taken a special interest in Timothy and held him in high regard. Timothy also alludes to the fact that he had earlier parts of his life that he wasn't very proud of. He states he was a "blasphemer, persecutor and arrogant man". Now, you can read a lot into all that. It's all part of understanding the complete context. Jesus didn't bad mouth the Greeks or their practices but preached alternatives. Most Greeks were curious to hear him and understand what he was about rather than looking to get behind him. It is really only after Jesus' death that Christianity began to arise in Greece. That's where Timothy comes in.

All that aside, who really cares what the bible says? Yes it has some good stories and is a useful historical tool but it should be clear that you cannot take fragments of it and attempt to make it a rule book for today. If you want to believe it, that's fine, but then have the intelligence to research it properly and understand the entire context.

Taken in complete context, the bible tells us that Jesus was a forgiving man who did not hold stereotypes about the people around him. He did not teach any form of hatred or persecution. If you'll recall, he even asked forgiveness for the very people that killed him! That is the important message in the bible. Christianity is about Jesus, not all the old ways and practices that preceded him.

The message of Jesus is what should count to Christians. I find it very hypocritical that many Christians are so good at finding fault in other people or condemning them for how they live their lives. That's not what Jesus taught. Personally, I could care less about what homosexuals do as long as it's between them. I see no reason why they can't be completely Christian in their behaviors and don't see it as fundamentally counter to Christ's teachings. As a Christian, I find it revolting that other Christians would be so arrogant as to force their beliefs on others with the caveat that they speak for God. You need to go back and read and study some more because you still don't get it.